Multibasing and PMC

Hobby talk / workshop
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Apologies for yet-another PMC/multibasing topic.

I think I know the answer to this, but here’s my question.

(Apologies in advance for not using KoW models but these are Mantic models)

I think we can all universally agree that this isn’t a great example of multibasing:

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A single model in the middle of a regiment-sized base.

But what do we think of something like this?

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Two models on a regiment base with other interesting terrain/scenery on the base. Is this okay?

Maybe I can get a few more on there in a squeeze:

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Is this okay?

The rules on this say:

Sometimes, the practicalities of model size and position will make this more difficult, or not possible, but in essence, you should plan to have 75% or more of the models being represented on the base.

But I also understand from Matt that this isn’t a rule but more of a guideline.

My goal here is to try and make a very interesting looking army from the contents of just a single Ambush box.

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First and foremost: it’s your hobby. No one is going to tell you how you have to build the models you bought.

That said, I -personally- think your examples are not in line with the intent of the game. Kings is a game that pits armies against each other. An army is a number of units with ranks and flanks and if there’s not enough soldiers in the unit, it’s not a unit.

In order to count as a “unit” that does have some measure of formation, the unit has to have a number of solders in there. The game suggests PMC which is 8 soldiers for a 10-men unit and 15 for a 20-men unit. I have been known to use slightly less than PMC, but I strive to build complete units. Personally, I would not use less than 7 soldiers in a troop, otherwise it wouldn’t be a cohesive unit.

If my terrain/unit base is so full that I cannot fit seven models on there, there’s too much terrain. Even so, with a bit of creativity, you can easily build ruins and fill them with units. See my ghouls for example:. In your case, remove the round bases from the models to gain more room. I think you can fit 15 deadzone human soldiers on that base if you move the front wall to exactly the border of the base and get them off the rounds.

Building an army from an ambush box is -I think- not possible. Depending on the ambush box, you can maybe get 500-ish points out of it, but little more.

For instance: the goblin ambush box is great. you get 40 goblins and 2 chariots/mincers. (edit: and eight mawpups)

using 15 goblins per regiment, you can build 2 units of sharpsticks. then, buid the 2 mincers as a mincer (monster) and king on chariot using 2 of the 10 leftover goblins. This leaves 8 goblins leftover for future projects. If you’re into converting, these rabble can be converted into luggits with a bit of spare plastics, so these final 8 goblins can become a luggit troop. On the goblin sprues, there’s also mawpups. The ambush box has 8 in total, which makes a great mawbeast pack.

Both the luggit troop and the mawbeast pack troop, as well as the two characters can be unlocked using the two regiments

This force counts 6 units and almost 600 points which is fair for an ambush set.

To conclude, multibasing is a great tool to create diorama’s. The added efficiency of the models in the collection is a nice benefit, but no goal in itself.

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I would echo that response with the main point (for me) being that your opponent ahould easily be able to identify what the unit is from looking at it. By having PMC (or very close to it) this requirement is easily met. If you are below PMC you really have to think “is this obvious for my opponent?”

I would then add to that, that having bases at PMC always looks way better and fits with the mass battle ranks and flanks side of things.

Finally, games at ambush sizes are fantastic, not just for beginners but also for those who have played the game a lot and fancy a slightly different experiwnce or a faster game. As such, id advise making an ambush force of 500pts or so and going from there rather than rushing to 2300 pts

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Think in part it can really depend on the army/units in question and exactly how you are doing the basing - are you fully multibasing or incorporating round based models into the unit base etc.

As an example of how events handle things, this was from last years uk Clash.

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Personally I’d still look to have a number of models on the base that is higher than the next size down (so 11+ infantry on a regiment, 21+ on a horde etc) - in line with the old MMC.

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Thanks for all your feedback.

First, I highly suspect these models will never see any play and if they did it would be very casual. There’s no local scene for the game, a few people playing multiple hours of travel from me and my day to day health doesn’t permit that level of travel often these days. Nobody seems to be playing The Old World either FWIW. The local rank and flank community died after 7th Ed WHFB — that I was the only person who picked up a copy of 8th should have been the clue.

Regarding the idea that a base needs to correctly represent the unit, I can see a 10 model unit being far easier to look full than a 40 or 60 model unit.

My plan is to assemble the entire Ambush box, prime and then start to assemble the army.

I haven’t played in a while now, but when I played previously my dwarfs were almost always in 20 model units and felt crowded when close to 20 models were on a base. I could see 11 models being closer to what I’d get onto a base like that.

I have an assembled but not painted giant box of dwarfs, I may spend some time this week playing around with some diorama bases.

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I already have way more than that for most of the armies I have and I’m not a huge fan of the smaller size armies. For me the appeal of the game has always been large armies.

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Worth mentioning that its somewhat model specific. Some models like reapers and tormentors wont allow close to PMC.

Most modern models don’t stand tall and rank up as well as old school models.

Even twilight kin corsairs are thin and spindly but they’re quite wide- stanced and some of them take up a surprising amount of base.

I just go for “looking full” these days. I think for a troop thats 7-8 for most models. For a regiment I’ve done 11-12 or so usually. For large infantry a regiment for me is always 3, a horde is usually 5.

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Move the wall to the back of the base and I don’t hate it. I’d prefer 6 gribblies and no wall but leading with the minis at least presents me with a unit I can work to recognize as whatever you’re telling me it is. And I’m less likely assume that’s an obstacle your regiment is hiding behind :stuck_out_tongue:

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I’m going to have the wall there with dwarfs with guns shooting over it.

But as these are not likely to see any play I’m not sure on the other ranks. I do want to go heavy on the diorama aspect though. I’m thinking maybe even some kind of banner to explicitly label them, which would remove any confusion.

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In fairness, if it’s all ranged models of the same sort, shooting from behind a wall – should be little room for confusion. I think it’s just that in your example piece you have a mix of models.

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Yeah my desire here was to show the amount of diorama vs. miniatures before getting my glue gun out and embarking on that project.

I’m not likely to run PVC Star Saga miniatures in Kings of War :wink: — they just happen to be on my computer desk in my office.

I’m working to get a better video/photo set up on my painting desk or my assembly desk but my assembly desk is covered in Firefight Orks right now and my painting desk has Halo Flashpoint models.

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Too much diorama, too few minis in my opinion :slight_smile:

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Not my models or my painting but a cobbled together image of my idea. I’d probably add a little more in terms of scenery to the base, but each unit would have a banner that clearly identifies what it is.

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Image credit: Daniel Bird and wargaminghobby.com

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Not the worst idea I’ve heard. :slight_smile: I’m sure there are people who play with only paper bases with text on, this would be a step up from that. :slight_smile:

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I mean these are not likely to ever get played with, but I also enjoy the crafting side of things more than painting hundreds of monopose dwarfs.

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Yeah, why would anyone go for monopose dwarfs? :smiley:
I agree that making bases is fun. A great aspect of the hobby.

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I hope we get some new sculpts eventually, but I have 4 of the dwarf army sets fully assembled and waiting to see paint.

  • 120 Hard Plastic Dwarf Ironclad with Command
  • 80 Hard Plastic Dwarf Shieldbreakers
  • 80 Hard Plastic Dwarf Ironwatch with Rifles and Crossbows
  • 4 Hard Plastic Ironbelcher Cannon/Organ Gun with Crew
  • 4 Metal Dwarf King

A Quick Look at the companion suggests this is approximately 4000 points when multi based in this style without adding anything special, so way more than I’d ever need.

I can see it being easy enough to get 1000-1500 points from an ambush box this way too, depending on the box.

I have full army boxes or more for:

  • Dwarfs
  • Elves
  • Undead
  • Twilight Kin
  • Ogres (so, so many PVC Ogres)
  • Abyssal Dwarfs
  • Forces of the Abyss
  • Empires of Dust
  • Goblins
  • Ratmen

Plus Ambush sets for:

  • Halflings
  • Trident Realms
  • Forces of Nature

And the Kings of War Champions set for the Northern Alliance will be here in a few weeks.

I still need to go through my piles of PVC models from Crazy Boxes and work out what most of them are too.

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