Because he built his army partly using a Nightstalker army box, he has quite a few cronebound elements… Ravager and Butcher regiments, a Reaper regiment and troop, two Mind Screeches … and he has a bound Butcher Fleshripper on the way. He does have access to Twilight Kin units and characters for list building as well, but for larger point games he draws a lot on the cronebound units mentioned.
It took us a while, but we’ve got around to painting up the rest of the Nightstalker army box, so now we have a tormentor troop, scarecrow horde, reaper souldrinker and banshee as well.
I’m considering adding more Nightstalker units, so we can run them as a small army, but if I am honest I am a bit put off by the degree of crossover they have with Twilight Kin armies that have a lot of cronebound.
There are obviously a few units that can’t be included as cronebound in a Twilight Kin list, but it’s not that many, really?
I feel like it’s hard to make the case that Nightstalkers are “as good” as a cronebound-heavy Twilight Kin list. That seems counterintuitive to me. I feel like cronebound options should be more restricted, or maybe less powerful, than the “in the wild” Nightstalker versions.
In a similar sort of position, having built an NS army then added TK units.
Certainly CoK25 making butchers regular in the TK list made a heavy Cronebound force viable.
NS are able to get more bodies on the table (with scarecrows and bloodworms) , have some very tasty LL units (Portal, Esenyshra) and the Shadowhulk is better overall (imo) than the TK goredrake.
Those are fair comments regarding bloodworms. I’m sure you can build lists that are distinct in competitive terms.
But I guess moreso than it just being a matter of “who does it better”, I just think it’s funny that they have two quite good, distinctive factions in IP terms, and they’ve created a situation where you might not want to play both, as being too similar.
Would it not be better to keep more a divide, and maximise the chances of people collecting both Mantic IPs? If that makes sense…
I feel like they managed it better with other lists – maybe Ogres being the best example. You can include Red Goblins in your list, a few units, and they can provide some fun, hobby variety and a bit of colour… But they really do feel like allies or bit-players, rather than feeling like the best bits of the Goblin list have been ported over, and are as viable for list-building as in the main Goblin list.
As a nightstalker player, I’m not convinced.
For me, TK don’t have what makes nightstalkers interesting to play and gives them theme and flavour.
Nightstalkers are supposed to be tricky and weird.
The major thing is that bound units don’t have mindthirst.
A defining special rule from the original list design.
It makes you rely on stealthy to get units through early shooting until you get stuck in. Encourages a more aggressive and… ravenous play style, because you need to close the distance (or access weird rules) to be inspired.
Also important in a fantasy wargame is the play experience of asking your opponent to reroll nerve because their inspiring is close enough to your units. You get to say that my rules and therefore reality in game is different.
Not spending points on or moving inspiring sources around adds to the “nightstalker experience”.
You can build a solid nightstalker list from the bound units in TK, but you’re missing most of the fun and unique stuff.
Soulflayers and mindscreetches are just a taste.
Scarecrows are a staple.
Zombies with extra Halloween are nicely weird thematically.
An expendable unit that’s fearless, stealthy and that has wild charge makes the list a little different.
Tormentors offer new weird rules and work nicely with scarecrows and horrors. A list design unavailable to TK
Nothing shouts the weird and twisted theme of nightstalkers quite like doppelgangers.
All the nightstalker suppost units, that work in a different way to TK.
Horrors, riftweavers and planar apparition.
Shades and dread fiends to spread dread around while being decent in class heroes.
Shadow hulks and void lurkers are great in their class, each with a nightstalker twist to their stats.
Fiends.
Basically cavalry, but they get to the average output a little differently.
Shadow hounds have become an interesting unit with regen and ferocious charge.
I do agree thematically that would have preferable for the Cronebound units to be toned down a bit, but made cheaper - think slave orcs in AD v regular ones or the ratkin slave units.
I played a 1200 point Nightstalkers versus EOD game over the weekend, and have to say, completely agree now with some of the comments above. They did feel like a very distinct army.
The Mindthirst rule, in particular, is very thematic but will also take some getting used to. I had a couple of units routed because my opponent had kept his sources of inspiring well away (Not sure it was deliberate, but it doesn’t matter!).
In general, fun to throw out a tonne of reapers and tormentors. They are nasty buggers. Used a Reaper souldrinker with the lifeleech aura to make them stick around a little longer.