Vanilla Elves vs. Sylvan Kin

What do people think? I’m a casual player, and just play with a couple of friends, so will inevitably end up fielding whatever models I own/think are cool. But I’m always curious about how the more competitive folks view the options.

One thought I do have is that the Sylvan Kin would be a lot more attractive if regular archers could get the deathroot arrow upgrade. Not having drakons seems like a big deal, and I’m not personally seeing enough in the Sylvan list at this time to get me particularly excited about it, except for the fact that I can unlock with my tree units. Windborne cavalry are cool too. But mostly I find myself wishing that the deathroot arrow upgrade was the army upgrade for the regular elves and that my archer units could get it, which would make a lot more sense given the fluffity -fluff -fluff -fluffity -fluff.

But like I said, there’s a lot I don’t immediately see by reading through stats. Who is really excited about Sylvan Kin, and why?

I was excited about Sylvan kin before I saw the list. Just my opinion, but I think it is the weakest list in Uncharted Empires. All the lists are pretty balanced though, and you could make a winning army with Sylvan Kin, but I don’t think it is as competitive as “vanilla” elves. Palace Guard Hordes are awesome infantry. Forest Guards are good and flavorful, but not as studly as Palace guard. You already mentioned the lack of Drakon riders, and I now have no use for my old glade riders (boo). Elven foot archers got whopped with the Nerph bat, and sylvan kin don’t improve on this. So no sylvan shooty army unless you want to go mounted, and that is a very iffy way to use expensive mounted troops (do the wood elves in KoW become Mongols?). The tree leapers are good, but for me they don’t fit in well thematically. The best unit the Sylvan Kin got was the new modified Tree Herder.

Maybe I am just having a hard time wrapping my head around the non-traditional elements and can’t see the army with fresh eyes because there is no place for my archers, war-hawk riders or Drakons, but I don’t see re-building my woodelves from scratch with mounted shooters which seem to be the Sylvan Kin’s strong suit.

Yeaaaaa it’s a weird list, innit? The cool stuff to me is the Verdant units, but the only synergy is with The Wiltfather, who happily is also like the coolest thing in the list. I think it was a missed opportunity to not give Sylvan Forest Wardens Inspiring (Verdant only), which would launch them into great units as opposed to mostly good, and make the scouting tree rampage list more of a reality. I feel like Wood Elf armies will port over just fine with this list? Warhawks are probably the only missing unit, apart from swarms maybe. But I also don’t know how competitive they’ll be, if that’s a concern.

Really, my thoughts on Sylvan Kin are:

  1. I appreciate that the Elf theme lists make it more clear what makes elf-flavored Elves special (Drakons + Chariots + Palace Guard + so on but especially Drakons).
  2. I feel like the roll out of army upgrades was done quite poorly with theme lists. There was cool potential to roll back upgrades to master units, but it wasn’t done. Plus you get weird interactions were master units with item options lose those options when in theme lists, when they could have been given the theme item pretty simply.

ALSO random terrible Verdant (with kitties) list I smashed up while responding:

Army: Sylvan Kin
Points: 2000
Unit Strength: 25

200, Forest Shambler Horde
200, Forest Shambler Horde
175, Boskwraith Regiment
175, Boskwraith Regiment
175, Boskwraith Regiment
175, Boskwraith Regiment
175, Boskwraith Regiment
85, Wild Gur Panther Troop
85, Wild Gur Panther Troop
305, Tree Herder
– Healing Brew
– Wiltfather
90, Forest Warden
80, Archwraith
80, Archwraith

I’ve only played two-three games and I’m an average player at best, so keep that in mind.

I think the SK list lost the most powerful units in the elf list and didn’t really get enough to compensate. The trees can be aggressive when scouted properly, but they lack the punch needed I think.

I don’t think going archer heavy will be good because shots don’t do that much damage. Giving archers death root arrows would be a waste since you actually need to hit for them to work.

On the other hand, a good elf list will probably comprise of PG and dracons and won’t be very interesting. The SK on the other hand have access to more “fun” stuff like windborn, wiltfather and super fast chaff. I’ll look forward to play my “wood elves” and I think it’ll be more satisfying the few times I’ll win with them :sweat_smile:

Here is my list for Conquest in Oslo in January:

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I’m probably wrong but doesn’t the square brackets 1 on the Wiltfather prevent him being given an item?

Cool list, thanks for posting.

No, the brackets denote the upgrade may only be bought once for a list. Some of these upgrades preclude you from buying items, but the Wiltfather does not.

As for the list itself, it’s a damn shame they didn’t make Gladestalkers regular like they did with Rangers for Free Dwarfs. Would’ve really had something interesting then, but c’est la vie!