Kings of War Champions

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Well, I guess most of us have seen the new teaser trailer for Kings of War Champions.

Piecing together a few bits relating to what the game might be like, from Mantic-

One of the most exciting launches early in the year is Kings of War: Champions… even if it has been developed by that goblin-lover Rob Burman spits into a dwarven ale. Pannithor is full of larger than life characters that can sometimes get a little lost on the battlefield because the regiments, war engines and monsters get all the limelight

Champions aims to change that by focusing down on the key battles between Champions (aka heroes) and their handpicked troops. It tells the story of these heroes and their rise to prominence within Pannithor. Champions still has the tactical rank and flank gameplay and awesome hard plastic minis you love from Kings of War, but it’s been designed to play faster and take up less table space. We can’t wait to reveal more in the weeks to come

2025 - A Time of Champions

Now…the piece de resistance. We all know that there’s nothing quite like playing out a huge battle on a leisurely weekend afternoon.

But for those times that aren’t a leisurely weekend afternoon, what if there was a faster way to get your fantasy fix? Something filled with exciting and interesting decisions, and that makes it incredibly easy to get gaming, even if you’re new to the hobby?

We also know Champions is somehow still a “ranks and flanks” game.

Fair to say there’s been quite a bit of head-scratching around how a hero-focused, fast and easy game could still involve “ranks and flanks” without being very similar to Ambush.

We know that some or all will be new models.

Now for the speculation…

If there was no mention of “ranks and flanks” I think it would be relatively straightforward to imagine that this was a fantasy Deadzone, with a hero focus. So maybe you’ve got one of the teased heroes, individually based, and they buff and lead a team of several other individually based sidekicks (perhaps drawn from the existing Mantic model range, or with some resin upgrades or additions). A fast, fantasy skirmish game.

But… “ranks and flanks”…

I wonder if it might be an Ambush-like game, using individually based models placed on movement trays, where the champion selected is on the movement tray in amongst their sidekicks.

This movement tray unit, with the champion, would have rules representing the champion’s various attacks and buffs.

Because it would be a movement tray set up, rather than a unit of individual bases, there is the potential for bonuses for getting a flank or rear attack on them.

I think in order to keep things interesting tactically, there would have to be a few other units in play also. So the champion’s party might be the central unit, but they might have 1-3 other small multi-based / tray based parties of sidekicks. At that point, you’d have a mini game of Ambush, with one unit (containing the champion) that would have some extra elements.

It would still use some kind of nerve based approach to how the party lived or died. If individual bases on movement trays were used I guess you COULD do model removal, but I just don’t think Mantic would go to something that people don’t associate with KOW?

The advantage of having the champions individually based, but on movement trays, would be that they could be plucked up and used as individuals in Kings of War or Ambush main games.

Does the above appeal? I dunno. TBH I would still be more likely to be excited about a game of fantasy Deadzone. The “ranks and flanks” element is still a head scratcher for me.

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I would have guessed KOW Champs was intended to tap into the MOBA crossover market - Judgement having found traction in the miniature version of a video game format, and Malediction looking legitimately good as well (with $500k on Gamefound currently) - but that rank-n-flank thing really throws me too :thinking:

Maybe it is a skirmish game still, like Vanguard 2E, but they’re confirming that things are on square bases so have flanks? So don’t worry, no rounds here? Still doesn’t account for the ranks part :disappointed_relieved:

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For reasons of completion, here is the trailer:

I would guess you pick a hero and two to three troops. I expect Mantic to use Champions as a gateway game to ‘proper’ KoW. So multibases would be a clever thing to do. Maybe more synergy effects for heroes and units, like auras and the like.

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Whatever it is I’m fed up of the cryptic marketing. I get the impression its cryptic because it’s not for the current KoW fanbase so they’re stringing us along to try and build hype. It looks like a moba and that style is uninteresting to me either way.

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I don’t like that either, but I also guess this is aiming at people who aren’t in miniature gaming at all, which might be a good thing as new people who’s first ever game is a Mantic game are growing the community more over those who switch from other games once in a while

I am a little hyped by the named character’s in general because new heroe models are always welcome

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The art makes me think gaming, anime and JPRPG. Will definitely appeal to both my sons, so yeah, if they’re courting a younger crowd, not bad.

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I’m listening to Counter Charge episode 768 - Kings of War Champions, with Andy Burdis and Rob Burman.

Well, it’s certainly full of content which explains how the game will be. I’m about half-way through.

Some brief notes:-

  1. It appears to involve 4-5 drops per side
  2. Multi-based units, with ‘rank and flank’ play i.e side charges mentioned a few times
  3. Simplified combat rules, discussion of units being either “in combat, or dead” or disengaged. Units won’t get tied up, because with fewer units that could be “boring”, and there will be no wavering
  4. Forces will be called companies, and will come as collectible sets, no list-building it seems
  5. Lore and backstories will come with each champion and their company
  6. It appears that Champions is intended as a simplified gateway to KOW but they expect people will collect multiple companies and just staying playing Champions
  7. It’s something that can be played on a standard sized UK dinner table or smaller even
  8. Started boxes will come with everything needed to play, including cardboard scenery (?)
  9. It’s kid friendly
  10. Tokens representing something like faction orders will be placed face down on each of your units, and ‘revealed’ during play
  11. An overall concept appears to be that Champions will reduce perceived “barriers to entry” for KOW: Simplified rules, even fewer models to paint, fewer rules, no list-building, explicit explanations of rules on data cards for unit, inclusion of everything required to play etc.

I’ll offer proper thoughts when I’ve finished the episode, but I’ll be interested to hear what others thing.

This is a huge scoop for Counter Charge, and it’s quite interesting to me that Mantic decided that this was the forum through which they were going to release the first tangible information about the new game.

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I think revealing stuff on a podcast is a good idea. A lot of people listen to podcasts while they’re working on their hobby so it’s basically the news headlines for wargamers.

I’m curious if we’re getting existing frames plus a resin model. I assume so, which means many of us will have spare frames for many (read: all) of the initial releases.

I hope it works out well for Mantic on this one. As a long time player/collector this is exciting and may bring lots more people into this wonderful community.

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So it is basically Mantics “Spearhead”?
AoS Spearhead seems to be quite popular, so it’s reasonable for Mantic to to do something similar.

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Certainly sounds like that.

Spearhead comes with a double sided board to play on. Curious to see if KoW Champions will have a board or neoprene mat option.

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Finished the podcast, certainly a lot of information about “the road ahead” in there.

What I have in my earlier post is probably still most of the relevant information as it relates to how the game will actually play. But a few more little points-

  • Smaller mat size / play space has meant some units can get into combat one turn one, if they’re fast, but in general they note that movement is kept to around 5" per unit.
  • Units will be 4-5 per side, hard plastic and a new type of resin for the champion. Described as really high quality, not brittle and coming to KOW in the future.
  • Profiles will feel familiar to KOW but I note they’re saying they’ve had to simplify / remove in some places, add in others.
  • Talk of one hour for a completed game.
  • Discussion of how characters and units COULD end up in KOW, with KOW profiles, but this feels like it’s a bit down the road.
  • 2 player starter set will have FOTA and Baslieans, but every month there’ll be a new collectable company, for the rest of the year?

Overall, clearly an emphasis on the idea that this is a more accessible way to ranks and flanks game with Mantic. I say that, rather than “this is a gateway to Kings of War”, because although undoubtedly it will be for some people, I think it feels like this is going to be its own thing, with different rules and potentially a different sales model.

I can definitely imagine stores being more willing to stock the 2 player set, and the various companies, and being able to do it on the basis that this is the entire range for Champions… Not having, as the podcast mentions, to have to make decisions about what stock from which factions is going to take up shelf space. This will be pretty efficient stuff, you could have one shelf with most of the Champions range and I think that idea is appealing.

There is also something to the idea that you just buy your company and that’s it… You’ve got that playable company and don’t need to overthink expansions down the line.

What reservations do I have?

From the point of view of being a current KOW player, I suppose I wonder will I actually be bothered playing this versus playing a game of Ambush.

I was a bit surprised to hear Champions will be 4-5 units per side, as in terms of models required to paint, units to mutlibase, it seems comparable to an Ambush set.

The play time… is it that dissimilar?

Guess it might come down to the rules for Champions, and whether they make it feel significantly different to Ambush. A lot will turn on how well they have designed it to be played on a smaller play space. I do sometimes play a quick game of Ambush on a dinner table surface, when we can’t be bothered setting up a full board, and at times it doesn’t translate that well, depending on the list chosen.

Based on the podcast, it does feel like they went into this very much believing that the two SOPs they were intent on retaining were multi-basing and ranks and flanks.

I just wonder if, when all is said and done, if I am convinced that these two things, which work really well in KOW, are actually something I want to see in a smaller space skirmish game. I’m just not convinced that actually a fantasy deadzone doesn’t appeal to me more… Does Dungeon Saga Origins even tick a similar box? For me I suppose an obvious advantage of this being multi-based is that it would be interoperable with KOW, admittedly.

I listed to a recent interview with Ronnie Renton, just out on the Tabletop Miniature Hobby Podcast, and when you hear him talk about his vision of what kind of games he wants Mantic to be doing… this idea of a fast-family friendly, fun, accessible game is very much what he is into… It’s a focus of Mantic that is, by nature, not going to be talked up as much on the dedicated KOW forums and groups.

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Yes, addressed on the podcast. Talk of a 2 sided paper mat in the starter set, and a proper mat available for purchase as well.

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Nice. I look forward to seeing what is announced today.

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Just put in my order for the dwarf starter force with no mat or terrain. I figure the rules will be on the companion too.

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Good looking box! And thanks for the recap @Rory

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Oh man can’t wait to get my hands on it, especially the new paladin knights.

Also not directly related but the Basileans got their army and mega army updated with the new paladin knights.

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Does this mean the “Sisters” are not getting an update this time around (or any time soon)?

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Champion boxes seem to be a cut down Ambush box + the Champion

Northern alliance get 20 tribesmen + 1 Frostclaw
(So… like take the ambush box, swap the ice kin for tribesmen and drop one frostclaw.)

Twillight Kin aren’t very close to the ambush box at all.

Nightstalkers don’t have the contents listed, but appear to get the full ambush box but swap 3 of the butchers for 10 scarecrows.

Goblins get a raw deal. – It’s straight up half the ambush box + Champ

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Really interesting to see the images, prices and video… because the podcast is one thing, but seeing it for purchase is another thing.

Overall, quite impressed.

My youngest son is really keen to switch and collect a company he doesn’t currently play. He also said he loves the idea of playing at the dinner table, and quickly.

For me, yeah, I might buy companies for factions that I don’t have armies for… which wasn’t my original plan.

In terms of sculpts… some great ones, but is it just me or are the basilean horses quite odd looking? Something chicken- like about them.

The price point on everything is higher than I expected, but not enough to put me off.

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To be fair, the goblin ambush set is an absolute steal (I’ve bought 2 and i don’t even collect goblins!), and now is just fairly priced against the others. Also remember that the boxes balance against each other - unlike the Ambush ones.

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