Trident Realms in 3.0

Here is a short summary we have for TR so far.

I would like to discuss new units and how they will affect our army.

Other things that were mention but not shown:

  • Water Elementals got Strider (I assume instead of pathfinder)
  • there is a general trend to slower CS/TC in all armies so Def 4+ will be more viable,
  • each Caster will only have access to spells in their profiles


First thing to note is that Water theme will get a decent support. It was/is not great right now which is sad as it is THE theme for living under/in relation to water army. The support is so far from Leviathan’s Banes and Dambusters which are a new unit. Very thematic to say at least. Slower bu nimble, flying heavy cav. Banes also got imprived and finally have a Re of 4+ like heartpierces are. Cannon-like piercing (3 - which is the part of what I was saying about lowering CS/piercing/TC in all armies) with a bit lower D3 per hit.

I really like Treeleapers. SP7 and fly/nimble is amazing. They have no shooting but this allows them to leap 14" a turn to the flanks. They are also amazing chaff. Something to be fast enough and cheap enough.

Gigas - I have mixed feelings about those. They are now a true anvil with 50mm bases, no elite and lower CS of 2. They have a Def 5+ armour and due to lover CS/TC/piercing are a solid choice. A lot will depend on if TR will keep their heal spell or loose access to it.

2 Likes

I think the changes are pretty exciting.
Gigas
Vastly improved imo. CS2 and vicious is good enough especially since their role is to be an anvil. Nimble could prove handy in scenarios. Really like the treeleapers. Time to go crazy with a frog themed army! I like the new bane. 4+ shooting always has a place. Dambusters seem a bit meh but defense 5 in the army is very much welcome especially with such mobility and they hit hard with guaranteed - 3 to defense on the charge.

I am super happy as I already have 2 troops painted. I hope more MSU for me with those!

Dambusters - This is hard to say. I do want water theme to work so I like them for that reason (and I love balista in general so I will have several enthral spells to cast). I expect a general change in Cavalry department in all armies. Def 5+ is big really as CS drops on most units (like no more CS2 infantry. CS is now for monstrous infantry. I an not saying ALL of it but spoilers indicates it in most cases).

Nimble on Knuckers, all frogs, dambusters and Gigas makes this a semi fast but super nimble force. I do like it. changing angels, hitting from different spots. Pushing enemy around.

Thanks for collecting these. I’m happy to see the frog side of TR get bumped up, one could make a pretty sweet all-frog army that wouldn’t be too terrible. Also nice to see all elementals getting a little something, including TR’s oft-maligned water ones (I see them in FoN only - doesn’t the Brohood have them too??)

Having played Gigas in a tournament this weekend, I’ll miss the CS 3, as it really helped open up knights (didn’t face any Def 6!), but the Def 5 native is really nice, I kept getting flanked by fast, weak stuff and having my crabs poked down. Nimble will be real cool to play with too.

As for Heartpiercers, it’s honestly way more of a nerf than they’ve let on. I won several games based on these little units having pathfinder to get where they needed to be, and ensnare to stick there. Likewise 12 base attaks means you can somewhat reliably send them into flanks to disorder flyers or add a few wounds to a front charger. 10 definitely disincentives that. Steady Aim is the one upside … but I would rather toss off 12 5+ shots while getting into position and then 12 4+ shots once I’m there, then 10 4+ shots and then 10 4+ shots once I’ve struggled through the woods I want to sit in. (It helps that I’m very good at rolling 5+ :wink: )

I’m not salty, but it’s just disappointing, especially as I got into TR to use Heartpiercers as mini-tarpits that also shoot. Now Heartpiercers just shoot a little bit (thankfully they didn’t lose regen 4!!), losing much of their versatility. I feel like I’m being railroaded into taking an Ensnarer horde, and I have no desire to do so. Maybe Mantic will figure out their Placoderm troopers and I can stomach that - Eckter is a beautiful sculpt and I hear phalanx is the best in 3E :cowboy_hat_face:

@Boss_Salvage Thanks for Your comment. No. HP still have regen 4+. Their full profile is in a 1st post.

It is indeed :wink: But cheers for confirming.

Also FWIW, I’ve heard Wyrmriders aren’t changing much, if at all. Bit disappointing, given how lackluster they are, but CS1 + TC1 seems to fit the army / meta. Hopefully still Sp 9 + Ensnare!

I expect them to stay Def 4+. Ensnare would be great. Now they are just unable to survive a counter charge.

I do not like them now and barely use. I do love the models and I hope there will be a small something for them.

Trident Just wrecked house at the Bay of Kings. Taking the 3 top spots. Best Gen, Best Painted, and Best Sports. With all of these players in the Top 8. Lets start this by saying Trident is Fun, very technical, and a challenge to defeat.

Huge swing back from the early release of Trident. A huge point to contribute, the Ensares are AMAZING and everyting bounces off them unless the oppoenent is willing to over commit with a huge amount of assets. High Nerve, Esnare, Regen = So good.

Looking at these new entries - WOW. The frog armies are going to be crazy with access to 3 unit types that Fly 7. and 14/16 ensare and pathfinder. OMG. Not going to be able to escape them.

The Gigas - Wow add in the Wild Charge aura from the water mage, and Haste, a gigas horde is charging 13" with 2 turns on the charge! Pathfinder on a secound horde, very formidable with an 11" charge.

Water Elemetals with Pathfinder and Strider are going to be nice. - Feels appropriate as I dont see how water is going to care about bearers. I’m convinced it’s both traits as all the elementals Im sensing will be adjusted somehow. Trident is going to be very formidable.

Heartpierces became irreg. So they wont be unlocking and they got dropped from 12 to 10 shots. Seemed huge to me vs. the other 18" range shooters. With the Jar of the 4 winds, it seemd really playable with the 4+ regen. With move and shoot I feel they will be holding the back lines on Push senarios as they would be good for holding tokens while advancing and supporting the front line.

Not sure Im convinced on the LeviBane. Reload is a horribly limiting and 1 hit on a d3 - might do 2 wounds a turn. So a Enthral 2 is nothing to get excited about. I would rather have a toop of Nokken or contribute to a Knucker and try to pin Dragons and such with Siren and Eckter.

The Dambursters are Solid. Straight up good. Can jump right over the front line and wreck faces.

This is going to be one of the funnest armies to play.

2 Likes

The Dambusters are very weird. Pretty decent melee package, very dangerous on a flank, but expensive. The Enthral… Have we seen the full text for Enthal? Is it just a pull, or does it disorder like the Siren’s ability? If it does, then they’ll be really really useful for harassing ranged units and things with Thunderous, but if not… it will be a struggle to get good value out of it.

Very excited for Gigas. Compared to 2E with the formation, a horde is 5 points more expensive, trades elite for vicious, gains a point of defense, and trades 1 crushing for nimble. Oh, and gets a fairly considerably larger base. Nimble is the big standout, and aside from being VERY cute (it’s definitely them crab-scuttling sideways) is going to be so helpful - corkscrews will be somewhat limited with Ht 2, but even just the ability to pivot during a march is incredible. It will make them better at getting into a blocking position, better at controlling the board, and better at claiming objectives late game. Incredible.

I’m not as disappointed as Boss_Salvage about the changes to Heartpiercers, but they definitely lost some of their more interesting stuff. Now a pure (mobile) shooting platform, they won’t be able to completely roadblock rough terrain the same way, and will have to be properly afraid of being charged. Still, it’s pretty cheap shooting, and I’ll definitely play around with both unit sizes.

On the subject of shooting, I do basically like what they’ve done with the Leviathan’s Bane. It still deals 2 hits on average, but 4+ smooths out the damage which I always prefer, and it loses one largely inconsequential point of piercing. With the price going up 10 points, we’re definitely paying for the Harpoon ability, and its value will depend a lot on the actual wording of Enthral - averaging 1", it’s far from a reliable disruption tool, and you’ll have no ability to control which arc you’re pull them in. I’m interested to see how they perform.

Aquamage looks neat, good/normal surge caster BUT ALSO very interesting Rising Tides ability. I’ll definitely be trying that one out.

Riverguard are an interesting proposition. I haven’t played them at all in 2E, but going up to spd 7 makes them a lot more attractive. Def 4 with ensnare is fairly sturdy, and if they can get into a flank or rear they’re pretty scary! Interesting skirmisher, hard to appraise.

Now to speculate, I expect Knuckers will get taken down a rung or two. They’re such an efficient package right now, you’re crazy not to take 3. Very interested to see the Kraken’s statline, I figure they might beef it up a bit to match the lovely new model. Lastly, I wonder what they’ll do with the Envoy! It’s such a flexible inspiring caster right now, will they try to narrow its role a bit? Excited to find out!

I feel like fly7 CS1/TC2 Ht4 Nimble, Strider, hitting on 3+ is CRAZY good. Haste makes them charge 16". Elite would make that enthral crazy. And they woulld just drag you 3-4 inches into combat with themselves or something you dont want to be in combat with. It just sounds fun. They seem like an auto-take to me.

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Gigas - Holding objectives in terrain with Def6 was their gig. But nimble with only 10" doesnt seem that advantageous but I bet it will be clutch in those brawling situations. I could see patfinder or that new Strider item. I know players that use the slow gigas very well. These are just better in my mind since that CS3 rarely came into effect. 6 wounds instead of 8 might be noticable. But if just grinding on an objective, I doubt these guys are going to break easy with Def 6.

@MikeGrant

2.0 naiads are nice as long as You use formation to get those HPs. Thing is HP will be what they were before they got all those tools to make them usable. Ensnarers do nave a nice nerve but def 3 and they are very meta dependent. HP are back to 8/10 shots but it still is a 18" breath with piercing!

Frogs - I do like them. SP6 riverguard were not that popular. I was using them a lot in CoK 2018 but not in 2019. SP7, def 4, no shooting is a unit I will use for sure!

Gigas - I would not be that excited about them. They got a bigger footprint (great from modellers’ perspective as Gigas ARE to big for a 40mm base). They have lost CS (which is a general approach to all units in KoW) so even with Vicious (and no elite) their offensive capabilities downgraded. But I do like nimble. Crabs are known for moving sideways. TR will have a lot of units that can reposition fast!

Rushing Tides - this Aura will have its use! Dambusters with haste and Aura - 17" charge range. Knuckers/WR 19" etc.

Water Elementals will not have pathfinder. The do not need it. They can not move at the double anyway and have strider (unless something changes about shambling).

Well… Most people who were using Leviathan’s Bane were saying all they need is Re4+ (ok, they have lost “+1” to the number of hits per shot). Still 2 210 point banes can do a constant damage (2 hits on average, 2-6 hits with piercing (3!) and energize with WE theme (1-3" enthraled unit is enough to get flanked by a surge and we finally got a cheap surge(8)! I did not see Siren so I have no idea how will she play in 3.0.

@Luke Dambusters are interesting. Best at flanks but can perform a nice frontal assault if needed. Enthral, from what was said on a FFS podcast, is just a reverse windblast. 6 dice on a horde does not feel much but You can full a unit 6"+ when combined with LBs. Each shot with a change to wound (toads deal damage with enthral). Thi can he important as those few wounds should be enough to one-shot a unit with WEs to the flank,

I agree about gigas. They traded 1:1 vicious for elite, CS for Nimble and base size for Def 5+. I have already ordered an add-on to oversize my existing bases :smiley:

Banes are piercing (3)! This is cannon standard so the highest we would see in 3.0. 5+ to 4+ is super reliable especially if You consider that You would shoot mostly high targets like behemoths and titans.

Treeleapers - I will use 2-3 troops (110! points). You can double charge something (preventing it from disengaging) and then fly with one troop behind the target. Or screen dambusters.

Knuckers - based on a general trend I expect them to loose some TC. Not sure if there is anything else they will loose/gain.

Things I would like to know more about are:

  • wyrmriders,
  • trident king.

@MikeGrant Dambusters hit on 4+.

1 Like

Mine will… :rofl:

Brew of Sharpness? I think it is best on Frostfang Cav… I think Haste might be cool on Dambusters (with Rushing Tides Aura).

What Ensares are Bad A$$ - no natural predator. They can bounce just about any single attacking unit and for sure, and the enemy unit cost far more points(resources). Because they have Pathfinder and Regen4+ they just get crazy good. They Shift damage very well. Just about everyone camps them on objectives and get cover to make 3+ infantry attack on 5+.

Lets consider Soul Reavers - 3+ 20 Att CS+1 TC+2 ( ignored)

5.6 wounds? Thats not doing anything to 20/22. Then they heal 2-3 of those back up. and flank you with the kraken thats standing right there.

Even with a dragon helping them out on the charge, the chance is very high they bounce off the ensares. And! that doesnt include if the Enares have Rally, Inspiring nearby or items!

For 230 pts they are godlike. They are Fantastic in any meta.

Only very few units have the hitting power to really hurt them, and I would still expect them to survive. No natural predator unless they are flanked or triple charged.

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:rofl:

2 Likes

3.0 is not going to be so hammer/shooting spam oriented and I expect more balanced lists. At least that is the designer’s goal. This makes ensnarers even more reliable.

I’ve not played with or against Trident armies but I’m looking at this with interest as I recently built a slann army (I’m nostalgic for the early WH!) I used the Herd list as this seemed to suit best but with more frog options now etc I would love to use this list if I can make it work. Thematically it would be better. I hope I can.

2 Likes

Well, with book in hand, I’m quite happy!

The Good:

  • Ensnarers keep pathfinder, and don’t even go up in points! I love roadblocking a forest with these guys, delighted to keep them as they were.
  • Placoderm regiments see a big buff, should be excellent road blocks. Seriously these might be a real standout.
  • Riverguard are much more interesting at spd7, looking forward to experimenting with both types.
  • Tidal Swarm regiments get Scout AND 5 points cheaper!!! This seems absolutely bonkers to me.
  • Gigas changes are old news by now, but I am extremely excited to get them on the table. Since I started watching for it, I’ve noticed plenty of times that Nimble would have opened up a sweet play.
  • Knuckers are only gently caressed with the nerf bat! Tiny bit more expensive, tiny bit less powerful on the charge, still incredibly fast and slippery.
  • Depth Horror Eternal gets slightly cheaper, slightly tougher. I’ve been thinking about it for a long time as a scoring unit that can cause some havoc, and this has sweetened the deal considerably.

The bad:

  • Thuul regiments jump 20 points, and I was having trouble getting good use out of them before. Seems like this is a me problem. I also liked the Hidden Ones, sad to see them go.
  • Wyrmriders. Regen 4+ is a dangerously good ability, but I have no idea when I would want to take these as they are. I guess if you want to alpha strike with the Kraken they’re your best bet? I don’t see a place for them.
  • Leviathan’s Bane seems to pay a lot of points for that Enthral utility, and boy oh boy does it seem worthless. A unit can be targeted by Enthral only once per turn, so you have to hope for a spike to get more than 1-2" out of it. VERY marginal.
  • Naiad Centurion loses Ensnare, which is probably for the best, but does limit its utility as a roadblock. I honestly wonder if the Stalker will be better at it, rolling the dice to get a wound and disorder to get around Yielding.
  • Naiad Envoys go to spellcaster tier 0, which is a little sad. I always liked that TR had these weird caster-BSB hybrids, but fair enough, it’s bad for the game’s health. Glad to see Aura of Heroism survive though, and the Fury aura is pretty cool.
  • I will miss the disordering Siren of old, though the new option is a versatile caster for cheap.
  • The “army special upgrade” is limited to only the amphibian units, though an almost orcish skullpole is a strong effect. I’d have liked to see something with wider availability, but at least we’re not Elves!

Overall, the changes create a lot of new exciting stuff, maintain my favourites, and only gently adjust the strong stuff. So many things to try!

5 Likes

Thanks for that rundown! Excited to start rebuilding my army properly and get back into it. Some thoughts:

  • Placoderm unit please, Mantic! These were great through the COK series, even better now. And Ekter is a lovely sculpt, please give us 3-5 more of that.
  • Awesome on Tidal Swarm buff, was looking to build some, even more now.
  • I really enjoyed Eternals and ran two in my laaaate 2E TR, had to drop them for unlock points tho. Maybe when points go up again in the US I’ll be able to bring them out again, happy to hear they’re buffed.
  • Guessing Wyrmriders simply got nothing? Making them as mediocre as before :frowning: I need them for unlocks sadly.
  • SUPER happy to hear Aura is still on the Envoy! Basically why I wanted to make a Neutral army, but I was sure it was toast in the new edition :smiley:
  • Placoderm lost horde option but gain troop option.

  • I must say I like Envoys more. Siren took the healing role on her shoulders. Envoy now are true bannerwomen. With 2 aruas too shoose from (on. One is a spell that grants an Aura) they are universal and useful heroes.

  • I like both Thuul casters, Wyrmrider centurion, Dambuster Sentinel and foot sentinel. Lurker is a great, 95 point hero that shoots! Perfect hero to take scout item.

  • Wyrmriders are more like a regular Cavalry which their cost and comparison to other Cav units suggest. 190-220 is a standard regular Cav point range. 2.0 to 3.0 change looks bad for them but they have a place. Light Cav wuth higher than normal number of Atts.

  • I was expecting Thuul regiments to cost 150-160 points. They are still very good. Important thing to notice is that Troops are still 105 which is GREAT.

  • Leviathan Banes’ harpoons are not perfect unless You use small footprint Greater Water Elementals. Even without them they hit on 4+ and have a cannon-like piercing which is great in 3.0 as hight CS is hard to find. CS3 is new CS2.

  • Centurion lost Ensnare but gain +1 Att and +1 nerve. Still fine but I like Stalker with Wings more.

  • Something You did not mention but I find very big change are Nokken. SHAMBLING, 12", Re4+, steady Aim shooting unit with ensnare and regen for 130 points. Oh my. I want at least one regiment.

  • Surge got better. With windblast (Mythican/Eckter), 4 Enthral sources (dambusters, Siren, Banes) and cheaper and better surge… Oh my.

I was moving to double envoys (for points) but psyched to know they’ve got some options going on! And auras!

Very interesting changes to nokken, color me intrigued. I’m also reminded of this PP unit for some reason:
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