Regnum Aeternum - Written Battle Reports for KoW 3rd Edition

Been busy for a bit, so I have some catching up to do.

All fun to read, thank you!

I took hex (with a periscope) to counter Alchemist’s Curse for my dwarfs.
I also find that casters just take the damage (and even do it myself).
Either the caster figures they can take it, or the unit that’s being targeted or supported is simply more valuable (would you sacrifice a Wiz to cripple a Steel Behemoth?).
I have the shooting to take out damaged casters, but still easier said than done.
It’s not been the solution that I hoped.

The undead didn’t have many large tagets and your giants deployed to take advantage of Rampage, so did 3 rampage charges.

Making the total: 12 charges vs rampage targets and 4 against slayer targets.
Even with favouring charges that use rampage that’s becoming a clear difference.

Herd vs Abyssal Dwarfs:
A tough match up for The Herd.
I think the ensnare and hold things up ability of Softhoof (the whole formation, really) is the main draw.
A blade of slashing might help the 3 attacks count as 4?

The gladestalker druid looks cool, but perhaps an over-investment for only 2 hordes of forest shamblers.
Especially considering that the shamblers’ role isn’t being the star of the show.

If I learnt anything by following The Hallow’s exploits; it’s that The Herd need to hit hard.

Nice to see some undead in action.
I’m edging toward paintning mine, so interested in how they go.
Interesting to see Abyss vs Abyss. They are the army I started KoW with, so I have a soft spot for them.

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I wish I could like posts more than once @DarkBlack ! I always like getting your insights. Thanks for visiting!

One thing I had been playing wrong with Hex is the spell rider that the hexed unit can not cast spells unless it received a Halt or Change Facing order, meaning you might take one hit of the spell, but could could potentially set something to charge them, allowing for more counter-play. But yeah, Alchemist Curse is powerful, and trading a 150 point caster for a titan or a centerpiece unit is probably a good trade when the opportunity arises! I’ve only run or encountered Curse/Hex a few times each, so I am still figuring those out.

Thanks for doing the tracking for the Giant! The Kingdoms of Men are in a pretty good spot for me. But it’s definitely been nice to have the Giants around, as so much of the roster feels underpowered with no special rules for the normal humans.

I’d encourage you to paint up some Undead! They are such a fantasy staple and have been fun to pilot. There is a surprising amount of tactical depth to them, but have been equally fun as mental cleanser and “juts for the heck of it” approach. Some neat themes in the list with Zombies/Goreblights and Skeletons/Rev Wyrms too. Lots going on, and plenty of ranges to choose from, with Mantic’s being nice and affordable.

The Abyssal mirror was a lot of fun, and it was really cool to see such drastically different approaches to the army. I hope to get more in with the Abyssals soon, and maybe a rematch here too.

The Herd is in such a weird spot for me. Bringing no real hammers the Abyssal Dwarf game was particularly rough and definitely inadvisable! I thought the Forest Shamblers might be decent front-liners, but while they were a lot of fun, they don’t quite have the durability or damage output needed, and so don’t seem particularly worth it. Other Elementals have specialties, but the Shamblers are pretty generic for stats and just scout up. Neat, but probably not effective to build around. The Gladewalker definitely an over-investment there as well, neat as they were with that double-spellcasting item.

If the Tribal Trappers had Ensnare out-of-the-box and the formation was just the Deadly Snares rule, I think I’d like the Trappers much more. Right now, at range they hit on 5’s, don’t have piercing, don’t have steady aim, and have only 18" range. They can’t really be both mobile and effective, and being stationary doesn’t give them a big enough boost to justify standing still the rest of the army really wants to move around, so they just feel so awkward. I’ll likely fit them in for some smaller games to keep things casual, but I don’t really see competitive folks picking these right now.

I did get another game in with the Herd in yesterday, and while I got a better understanding of a few specific units, the army as a whole is still a bit confounding. It’ll probably take a few more games with them before things start to “click” more with that roster. That report should be up in a few hours though.

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And as-foretold… up now is Battle 055, a “near-mirror” match between the Herd and the Sylvan Kin. The report can be found here.

The Herd and Sylvan Kin have some interesting parallels in the rosters, and we ended up bringing very similar lists, with both of us running some flying monsters even! As a result, the Herd didn’t have the best of showings as my opponent is a more careful tactician, than I am. I got some nice insight on a few units though:

  • Tribal Spearmen Horde. I liked these as a battle line unit. Pathfinder somewhat mitigates the usual horde unwieldiness. You need to pay for TC now, but it seems worth it with 30 attacks. The horde size gives them good Nerve, and overall these felt pretty good.
  • Guardian Brutes. They are 20 points more, but actually pretty comparable to the old Longhorns, gaining +1/+1 Nerve, Brutal, Fury and ~1 more expected damage vs most targets. I need something to deal damage, and the Brutes look like a good place to start!
  • Druids with Bane Chant. These is a very “basic” pick, but with the a la carte spells nowadays, these are repeatable 65 point sources of Inspiring and BC. “Mid-tier” infantry like the Spears want BC when they can get it, and these seemed good to have around, brief as this game was.

As always, a big thank-you to @Cartwright for fitting in the game and for hosting!

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Thanks for the game on short notice!

The gladestalkers are a tough match-up vs the scorchwings: 12 attacks on 4s with elite and 24" steady aim vs 14 attacks on 5s because of stealthy on 18" steady aim. I was hoping to concentrate and take out one on turn one, but I can’t complain about two wavers. From there you were playing 1900 vs 2300, and that’s a high hill to climb.

As soon as the scorchwings were down, I was very willing to piece trade and kill off your unit strength. I guess this was consistent for the Herd–glass hammer alpha strike means we know pretty early on who is going to win.

Agreed on the hydra. It’s a nasty tarpit that requires a ton of effort to take off. I would use it like I use cavern dwellers–push out front as thicc chaff and force the tempo early.

I still don’t feel like I have a good handle on how to use the Sylvan Kin. It’s not an army that makes sense to me like Brothermark, Northern Alliance, or Abyssal Dwarfs. But I enjoy trying! The GAE are very forgiving once the scrum starts because of their speed, height, and shambling on a small base.

Thanks, as always, for the fun game.

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Being a fantasy staple is why I got them, as my not necessarily KoW fantasy army.
The main issue is a very long paint que.
I’m also not keen on surge as a mechanic, but I figure I’ll come around playing Undead for a bit though.

The surge shenanigansin this game is a good example of why.

Thanks for the new report! That was rough though! :scream:

I think the hydra is a good anvil, with good nerve and regen, and should be thought of a such.
I think that the extra attacks is actually a defensive ability, in that it disincentivises your opponent from doing chip damage or trying to grind it down.
It makes your opponent not want to fight it.

As you saw in this game.

On the list; I like the extra hitting power!

I’m not sure scorchwings have the staying or hitting power to justify a horde. If they’re not going to hit that hard and be fragile then their role is support and distruption. In which case you might as well take them as regiments and use the points elsewhere. Like taking the lycans as a horde instead. The extra nerve would help then get the most out of regen.

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Thanks for the report!

But wow does that sting :grimacing: Not going first was obviously not a great choice on the Herd’s part (:people_hugging:) but the blue beasties were punished pretty hard by the dice too. That opening volley from the Gladestalkers did almost twice what it should have - while you probably would have lost one horde completely to focused fire, you would have been able to abandon the flank with everything else and then play across the cover of the hills. It would have sucked but been a price to pay for deployment woes and not grabbing the initiative. Obviously not what went down when that split fire paid off like gangbusters!

Despite what happened in this game …

I still think the Scorchwing hordes have play for the list, even if I live in a very low shooting meta right now, so their fragility doesn’t come to the fore often.

Lots to like in the rest of the list IMO, glad to see you embracing the Brute life. Two of those hordes certainly do work! Ditto the spear horde. Mine has sharpness stapled to it these days, but when I’m truly strapped for points (so under 2000) I go with chalice of wrath because wavering is the worst (plus it means all my hammers are furious, between Brutes and the Stampede). I’ve only run one winged Beast and she put in so much work. Two might be too much for me (I’m not great at piloting flyers, having spent years ruining their plans) but 205 pts is hard to argue with.

Really the Critters are the loser of the list for me. I actually printed and started painting three regs of them to shake my chaff game up … before realizing how bad Sp 6 is on top of the rest of that package. I don’t consider myself a true alpha Herd player, but being the same speed as most of my hammers just wasn’t going to work for me. And so my trusty Braystrider troops stuck around :horse:

EDIT: Oh right, the Hydra exists too :man_shrugging: I dunno. Frankly it’s probably better now than a year ago? The new scenarios generally want more token holders, and that dude can certainly hold a token! Plus it’s US2 now. Maybe there’s something to yeeting him forward and demanding somebody deal with him? Full on distraction carnifex style.

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Well, I can definitely respect a painting backlog as an excuse @Darkblack! Mine got bad enough I’ve given two small armies away over the last few months. I am hoping to see them across the table from me in a few more months time though!

The Undead’s surge tricks have seemed (to me) to be largely limited to flanking maneuvers if you don’t break a neighboring unit, like in Battle 049 where the Revenant Cavalry kept abusing my stumbling and fumbling Giants. Wraiths with Nimble and Fly look like one of the few “tricksy” units available, but they are just Speed 7 and only Height 2, so it is harder to really do broken things with them. Here, with Speed 10 and Height 5, the Greater Air Elemental is a terror and can easily start instigating fights all on their own before the lines can even clash. They are hard units to fight against, and they still seem as deadly as ever, though I didn’t get to put up much of a fight against them and their tricks. I had very little to hunt or kill the Surge Caster, nor the ability to boop the elementals and ground them.

As for some more thoughts on the Herd…

I’ve tried Scorchwing regiments and they just drain my brain trying to cover all the angles and use them effectively. It’s been a lot of brainpower just to get 7 non-piercing shots in occasionally, so Hordes are the way to go for now for me. I was hoping to get a volley off in Round 1, and then just start charging stuff in Round 2 alongside the Beast and Avatar, as they hit harder than they shoot, but that was not to be this time! They’ll be around for a bit, so hopefully they’ll have some better games soon.

I thought I was slowly figuring out the Hydra, but these are some better insights! I’m still thinking of it as a potential hammer, if I can only jump through some hoops, but “aggressive tar pit” is probably a better way to view it, and any damage it gets in should be treated as a bonus. Charge in and tie up something scary and hopefully I can deal with it a few turns later. Deploying at the line was a good call from me this time, but I think I still need to be a little more aggressive with them generally. All good thoughts here from everyone.

The Critters weren’t as useless as I thought they’d be, but “just dying” is a rather low bar. I wish these were on par with Orclings or Imps instead for some variety, but as-is, I think they are still the worst chaff option we have.

I definitely liked the Tribal Spears and the Guardian Brutes, and looking into hobbying up more of the former. The Spears seem like a good way to control space on the field, and I’ll keep the Brew and the Chalice in mind for possible upgrades. Thanks @Boss_Salvage! The Centaurs caught my eye recently, and I want to try them out at some point. Any insights or advice on Centaurs of either variety?

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So! When I started my Herd, I needed some chaff and had some centaur models that were going in one way or another, but had some flexibility on which flavor of horse-person they would be. For maybe the first time, I actually looked up what a centaur does in Kings of War …

While I loved the nimble on the Hunters, that’s where the love ended. Striders just seemed better on all other accounts, from survivability to being able to do something if they aren’t dealt with, which are both important for my chaff needs.

We should pause here and note that Hunters have been buffed since the big green book:

The buff to their shooting wouldn’t have changed my mind, but it wouldn’t have been so one-sided in favor of the De 4+ Striders. Them going up in points doesn’t help their argument, however I suspect it’s based around the performance of the regiment size, which can also unlock, and not the troop, where I was shopping.

Flavor of centaur troop decided, I still wasn’t really sure what to expect from them in game. 6 very good attaks was underwhelming on paper, but the durability seemed good. As it would turn out, 11/13 at De 4+ is really solid. They don’t necessarily kick their way out of a chaff-off with so few attaks, but they take concerted effort to remove.

Having used them a few dozen times now, the real upside is threatening flanks if they aren’t dealt with. Speed + a wide base gives them a large threat, and 12 3+/3+ in the flank is very real. I will often crash them into the front of things to block (Ht 3 paying off against most all line units), but I’m always looking for tasty flanks to punish my opponent for not respecting the Centaur Master Race.

Aside: I literally have only used Strider troops (and centaur heroes), nothing else. In the past, I’ve faced Strider regs, which are often underwhelming and in many lists I think outclassed by faster or hittier options, and I’ve heard tell of double Strider hordes. Honestly their attaks seem low for a cav horde, even if baked in CS and pathfinder is really nice. Low De as well :confused:

Edit: I’ll acknowledge that Strider troops have two big things against them: 1) Harpies exist and 2) Panthers exist. Striders are certainly thicker chaff than both of these, and are wildly more dangerous to the enemy’s health, but the Herd is a list flush with fast chaff options.

Edit 2: Also arguably 3) Shambler regs exist :stuck_out_tongue: Speaking of thick chaff that are juuuuust fast enough to be relevant.

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I should have replied sooner, because try as I might, I can’t think of anything succinct to add in here. Even at troop sizes, there is a lot to consider, and the Sriders are an odd arrangement of stats! Thanks for sharing your thoughts @Boss_Salvage. It looks like I have some hobbying work cut out for me as soon as the weather gets a bit better for priming!

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I’ve gotten some games in recently!

Battle 056 was against a surprisingly strong Halfling list. Aura options are no joke, and they look like a really strong combined arms style army.

Battle 057 was against a very spooky and well-themed Nightstalkers army, but a very new player.

The Ambush games were neat (regiments for the win!), but my Varangur raiders were not well suited to it. I brought a fair amount of cavalry units, but our tables were 3 feet wide for 1000 points, so their maneuverability was very limited. With such a small play space, I think every game that day was a tabling, unfortunately. These were part of an escalation league though, so they will be bumping up in points and table sizes next month, and that should allow for more back-and-forth. It will be really neat to see both the Halflings and the Nightstalkers armies grow, and I am really looking forward to playing against them more.

And then I also got in an unexpected but welcome weeknight game against @Cartwright recently, with the granola elves and some unpruned elementals of the Sylvan Kin against some rusty combined arms of the Kingdoms of Men. Battle 058 can be found here. It was a close one!

  • Triple Ballistae did work in the early game, but war machines are still swingy and the dice were rather uncooperative as the game progressed and the targets became less idea. They are terrain dependent as well, but definitely worth exploring more since they hit on 4’s and are so cheap.
  • Crossbow horde was nice, but not used well, due to my opponent’s pressure and my inexperience with them. Still, they contributed in both damage and scenario play, and the removal of Pot Shot is a very welcome change!
  • On the opposing side, an aggressive Wiltfather and multiple Greater Air Elementals are hard to deal with. Go figure! I think we’ve both used the Wiltfather and Tree Herders before, but usually in a more passive role. The yolo Wiltfather was quite hard to deal with, so I was taking notes for some future Herd lists…

My opponent brought a neat list to explore more of the Sylvan Kin, and played a very solid game while doing so. Thanks again for fitting it in!

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Thanks for the fun game and great writeup! As always seems to be the case, this one went down to the wire.

The pikes were tough and caused some problems. Similarly, I didn’t have great answers for the generals and mostly intended to ignore them and just eat the occasional flank or rear. I find that to be more effective than changing out my entire gameplan to pivot around to handle them.

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Thanks for the full size report! I’ll admit I only skimmed the Ambush level games, I only have so much to personally relate to non-standard games. Hopefully you’ve enjoyed the change of pace? And played some new faces.

As for the big game, happy to see it go so close despite early turns. I do feel like you should have been more and not less aggressive, especially when it came to the Sylvan shooting. Also, I think we can all agree what the play of the match was:

The Lute ASB makes a fun play for Nimue, lands a hit, sticks the damage, and clobbers the legendary spellcaster with the instrument!

I love to see it!

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Thanks, as always, for sharing.

The games of Ambush looked fun, but like they can swing dramaticly.

On the big game
you could have been more aggressive, but your opponent’s agression put you on the back foot.
It was till a close game, afterall.

Your giants did 6 charges against slayer targets and 1 against a rampage target. Brining the total to 10 vs big stuff and 13 vs small stuff.

Getting into fight with a tree herder did give the slayer total a boost though, those fights tend to drag on.

Rampage still looks more likely to come into play, but not by much.

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