Trident Realms in 3.0

[Boss_Salvage]

For posterity, here’s an all amphibian trash person spam list that I slapped together yesterday. The goal was to take only Amphibian units but also go obnoxiously hard:

Riverguard Dambuster Horde - Brew of Sharpness, Poison Frogs
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Treeleaper Dambuster Regiment
Riverguard Regiment - Poison Frogs
Riverguard Regiment - Poison Frogs
Riverguard Regiment - Poison Frogs
Riverguard Arbalest
Riverguard Sentinel - Poison Frogs
Riverguard Sentinel
Riverguard Sentinel
2300 14(25)

All flying, almost all nimble, loads of shooting. The Arbalest could be a Riverguard troop in the same chaff roll, but I went with the cooler mini with a shooting attak and slightly better Nv. The height difference is a mixed bag - better for shooting, worse for hiding with a token.

I was going to put the Periscope on that one Sentinel, just to be cheeky (and for engaging over hills), but RAW I’m not sure it works. Leaper sets its height to 3, and I’m not sure if the Periscope’s +1 Ht modifies that to 4 or just gets reset to 3, as Leaper specifies a number It really doesn’t matter, so another brutal-on-demand it is.

EDIT: I’m still surprised at the De 3+ on the Treebusters, it’s lower than all of the other large cav shooting flying regiments that have defined the meta in the last years (which are 4+). Treebusters don’t feel like they have a huge leg up on their counterparts, apart from the 22" effective range on their P(1) shooting, nor do the models seem to justify it. Even logically, the Riverbuster is a De 4+ frog on a toad, for De 5+. Wouldn’t the Treebuster be a De 3+ frog on a toad, for De 4+?

[MiSiO_1]

I really dig it!

I think I will try 1-2 Treeleaper Dambusters (I think we will eventually call them Treeleapers are original TLs are gone) in my lists. This is super interesting unit to try. I believe Your list need a formation too!

Yes. It is wierd. Ravens are def 4+ (but 11/13 nerve) and Scorchwings are 4+… Also ravens (6 Att, 18" and P(1)) and scorchwings (7 Att, 18" no piercing) are less shooty. Dambusters have 12 shots with piercing (1) which is approx. TWICE as much. And are 12/14 nerve to compensate SOME of the low defence.

Their 3+ is wierd to justify visually BUT we get more offensive shooting for the cost of resilience from rules perspective. I think this unit will do work. Especially in-mass.

[MiSiO_1]

Periscope gives +1 to Your 3 when drawing LoS so it is a valid choice!

[Boss_Salvage]

I’d need an FAQ to confirm that, given the wording involved There’s a small bit of precedent on how Kings deals with specified numbers, like WC (X), and modifying them that I believe disagrees with adding +1 to a set Ht 3.

Re: Treebuster defense, I had the same thought that the De 3+ is less of an issue as you spam them harder. Which I do think is unhealthy for the game but hey ho, we don’t have general spam limits yet. (Also note that Soulflayers are in this category and De 4+)

As a general rule, I now try to limit myself to three of anything max, no matter the game size, which makes the Amphibian only army less exciting. You have to take extra Riverbusters just to make up points and unlock heroes, and they’re really quite mediocre the more I look at them. For example, the TC2 is what makes them decent hammers … but they’re so slow and wide that you’re likely to get charged first. Which means you’ll want fury or headstrong or staying stone on them so you can at least swing back … but you’re always going to take offensive items on them because Me 4+ is floppy and bad.

EDIT: Good point on the formation being relevant to Amphibian lists! I totally glossed over it.

[Sceleris]

Periscope “increases height by 1”
Leaper “This unit treats its height as 3”

To me, Leaper looks like default rule, so the combo would stick at 3, but probably something the RC need to rule on?

TR are one of the armies I don’t have, but the plastic riverguard/frogs look great and a swamp vibe army rather than ocean one is definitely more in my paint locker [plus one of the local guys has a really, really stunning coral style TR army and there’s no way I was going to even think about going down that road/river!]

Having played against it the old formation probably was a bit to good, but thull are still decent esp with the kraken upgrade.

There seems to be lots of specific keyword buffs - naiads, amphibian, deep one - so the supporting units etc do depend/impact how you build a list.

Siren - it’s good imo she lost some specific punch/range, as 4 spells a turn can be vile.

One thing I’d note is that TR can now have a fully flying Ambush army (all with Strider/Pathfinder) - as Riverguard don’t count as Irregular

[MiSiO_1]

Depends of how You define spam. Spamming 3 wizards or even flying heores - that is a spam in my yeyes. Taking 3 of the same unit - that is army composition (especially in Trident where there is no ‘best’ choice). I think army building might be something that get fixed in 4.0 edition anyway. Ronnie said 3.5 should have beed 4th and that it is something to expect!

True. Soulflyers are Def 4+ - I guess someone hates good dambuster units lol

I would love to see a fix on how we name large infantry units. They were supposed to be troops and regiments but by a mistake had to be called regiments and hordes. Which is wierd in general (6 model horde).

Regular dambusters - my fear is that we will see more phalanx so those cost reductions on dambusters and Thuul/DH kraken aura are are not a buff but an adjustment to the reality. Dambusters can be great hammers in shooty builds that force a forward movement. Sure Me 4+ is swingy BUT wounding on 2+ with vicious is not. Wyrmriders hits on 3+ but wounds on 4+ … That is why I will enjoy cheaper dambusters for a while and see how they turn out.

[MiSiO_1]

Ok. Working on my 3.5 list updated to (2024) version.

Replaced Hidden Ones with two Riverguard regiments and Sentiel.

Sadly less Def 3+ units means an Aquamage with barkskin will not work that well. Also Siren will not work as her enthral got nerfed.

I took 3LB as a replacement her and took 2 scoring arbalests. Those will benefit from Vicious and can work as cheap chaff protecting heartpiercers.

I still have a decision to make. I either take DH horde, thuul regiment with drunken rum or Treeleaper Dambusters*… Any advice?

(3rd one I have painted recently).

[MiSiO_1]

After several games with new rules I must say nothing really changed in the army.

I keep thinking how NA update brought most units together thanks to Frozen/tundra fighters and added needed buffs to units like Dwarfs and naiads (Phalanx, LL, extra attacks, tundra). All of the above support mixed arms lists. New unit im forms of ravens puched the army to top tier. Speed 10, shooting Alpha with Frozen synergy… Perfect.

On the other hand TR changes divided trident into sub factions. You want Riverguard? Get Sentiel. Want thuul? Get Kraken. Some synergies Has no sense too. GWE buffing naiads means you can use him with ensnares’ horde only. Which is well… Thematic but nothing morę. Water Subfaction is just bad too but it was like this for some time now. And potential CoK changes will never fix that. We had one chance to get a proper makeover and it failed.

Not sure if there is a single player excited about new units too. Treeleapers (they fixed the problem with unit name) and Arbalests do makes TR players excited which is just terrible! We should be excited about new toys.

I am a trident player. I have AD and EoD but I Play trident. Have 8500+ painted and awaits some new releases but I feel no excitement after testing some of the new tweaks and rules.

I feel forced to use Kraken as formation is out and there are no other Me3+ options that are not 250+.

I did try Arbalests but I do not get those. 220 PTS for 10 shots and goblin nerve.

Riverguard - another anvil. Troops with tridents are very solid flankers. Regiments cost a lot for what they can do.

Dambusters were my favorite unit for a long time. Love the concept but hordę was just bad. I was using regiments but with new changes… Dambusters are still not great (CLASSIC TR treatment… You give 2, you take 3 away - got cheaper and got better brutal option but lost regen and shooting AND nimble) but with new changes regiments got bad too.

I have no idea how to mąkę a winning list with this army anymore. Latest releases (ogres, EoD, TK, NA, Halflings and RFO) are ALL top armies. All of them. TR feels middle tier AT BEST.

Even TR promotion on Mantic is just poor. Not a single video showing new profiles. Or models. Mantic was super excited about TK. We had videos about those. Ravens were something everyone was talking. TR promo is not there… 2 blog posts. No one cares.

[Sceleris]

I’d certainly agree that TR are not in the same tier as the full TK revamp and some other newer armies and it does look like you need to narrow down a theme to get the best of the list synergies.

Having said that, the new Ambush set has intrigued me enough with the models to start a TR army, although there will be lots of 3rd party stuff thrown in.

[MiSiO_1]

Not sure if you have to narrow things down. Tundra fighters is a great example. New rule for the majority of the army elements allowing different pieces to work with each other in mamy compositions.

I do not Mind thematic synergies too! NA had Wild Charge. It was “army special rule”. Trident nad ensnare. But what makes NA like an army is tundra fighters.

Riverguard are very fun to Play as a Subfaction. You can go all-in with units, Monsters , Heroes. And as a Subfaction Riverguard works very well. They have solid playstyle, own aura, shooting.

[Fugue]

I’m doing well with a more or less high defense list at the moment although it’s low on shooting and movement.

2 gigas
2 giants
1 placoderm w/guard upgrade
2 swarms w/upgrade
2 riverguard with frogs and cs1
2 knuckers
2 aqua mages w/weakness. 1 w/ barkskin and periscope. 1 w/ veil 3 and fireheart
trident king

I keep everything pretty tight except for the knuckers and sometimes the swarms/riverguard, they go where they are needed. One game I did deploy a giant, the placs, a swarm and a mage off to the side and they preformed well, however.
As far as using the new stuff goes, I face too much shooting to go with low defense units although I want to try kraken “formation” at some point.
I’m also tinkering with a dambuster heavy list that makes use of the formation but I lack the models for it at this time.

[MiSiO_1]

I think Gigas is my next core to try too.

I updated my list with Kraken+2 thuul ATM for some much needed punch.

[Bandrol]

When going with the Kraken consider take some Thuul-troops. They are pretty cheap and punchy and now they finally can take advantage of the aura

[MiSiO_1]

True. Troops could get a BUFF front Ineesha too but thuul/Kraken feels morę and morę like a ‘must-have’.

Thuul are also cheapest unlocks we have

[Sceleris]

Tend to build stuff i like the look of and worry about overall competiteness later(!) - looking at enough bits for 3 regiments of naiads, reg and 3 troops little frogs, 2 reg/1 horde and hero big frog, wyrm rider horde, giga horde, placoderm reg, 2 depth horror hordes and assorted heroes. Will get giant/kraken.

[MiSiO_1]

There are units to work with for sure !

[MiSiO_1]

Had another game against NS yesterday. 1600 points.

I keep testing new options. 2 Arbalests, Riverguard regiments and troops and now Kraken with Depth Horrors as previous lists with Riverguard had ZERO punch. I was initially thinking about thuul but the cost difference between DHs and Thuul is not that high and we get a ton. Nerve (that will balance lack of Stealthy), CS1, fury etc.

Sadly I feel new units are just overcosted or co not work great and synergies are, well… occasional at best. Depth Horrors are solid with Kraken but elite, 24" range shooting and frostclaws (or gladestalkers or any other shooting for tat matter) are just too much for them to be a valid option. Kraken was solid. His slayer is less useful now when so many players more towards infantry lists (which is a direction RC changes and Mantic releases are heading too) but he was most useful unit in the army.

Arbalests - not sure what to think about those. Medium range is the name of the game for TR and 110 for a unit like this is… ok. Nothing amazing for a DHE cost range but another 5 shots to support naiads. I feel like we nees to spam frogs to make them better tier (Sentiel aura+few units to benefit from it).

I do like riverguard troops. I think from ALL the changes this one is the one we might see more in a future (and maby regiments of javelin riverguard). Placoderm are another unit we might see more often and Nokken shepherds are good too.

Anyone tried to use Treeleapers? I REALLY do not get their cost. I compare them to units like Frostclaws and I do not get it. I would love to use them but zero idea how to do that.

Did Yo use formation too? Dambusters in the formation (no nimble) is what makes me think twice before I add it.

How are Your games? Some nice combinations that work?

[Bandrol]

A fun use of Treeleapers is positioning them into fields. If an enemy charges them, it is hindered. If they shoot, there is no cover penalty. I will give them a try as soon as I’ve got my parcel.

[MiSiO_1]

We must remember they have no pathfinder ans their range is 14" which means that they gry charged when seen.

I will try them myself. 2 with barkskin. One will hide behind his barkskined fellow. Then 24, P1 shots.

[Bandrol]

Plus 5 from the sentinel and vicious. That’s about 8 wounds on def5. That’s a 7 to waver for most things. If you add a siren‘s mind fog and any other ranged element, the target will probably go down. I’m pretty curious on trying those hit and run-Tactics, Trident seems to be designed for with Treeleapers. Maybe a DHE with the boomstick for long range shooting is the perfect addition to that nimble battlegroup…